Engine Mounting Studs

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glacoste
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Engine Mounting Studs

Post by glacoste » Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:57 pm

Trying to remove the engine mounting studs.
Put penetrating oil on yesterday. Placed double nut on end of one stud and worked back and forth. Moved slightly. Stripped threads on both the nut and stud. Tried using a BFH, but not too much, don't want to mushroom the ends. Was told the studs pass through hollow tubs, don't want to damage.
Any suggestions?
Thanks
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by Snakeoil » Fri Jul 19, 2019 7:43 pm

A problem reported here by others is the studs tend to seize in the thru hole casting lugs of the crankcase. In some cases, they have had to saw them off to get the engine out. Aluminum oxide is nasty. It's an abrasive, so not conducive to things "sliding by" and it is at least double the size of the original aluminum.

You could try to heat the crankcase area with a propane torch and then use a BFH to break them free. You can always get new studs if you damage the ends. Just file off the upset metal once you break them free so they'll pass thru the lugs in the crankcase.

I would expect that machines run in the winter and exposed to salted roads have a greater tendency to have this issue. I put a generous amount of anti-seize on both my stud when I re-installed my engine.

Search the topic and you'll find threads discussing the issue and how others were able to get them free.
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by glacoste » Fri Jul 19, 2019 8:01 pm

:thumbsup:
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by WEGUNTER » Fri Jul 19, 2019 8:07 pm

yep. torch is the way to go.

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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by gobium » Fri Jul 19, 2019 9:26 pm

The front mounting stud is the problem not the rear.
First Jack up engine to release bearing weigh on stud.
Only hammer on ONE end of stud, only mushroom one side. put vise grip on stud hammer and try to rotate.
Try to get it loose
Once it looses, put the stud out from other side.
Mount studs are chesp.

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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by glacoste » Sun Jul 21, 2019 8:06 pm

thumbnail - 2019-07-21T200435.427.jpg
Tried all the recommendations for removing the studs. Ended up snapping both sides.
I found out something new as well. Bench presses don't work if you lay them horizontal......
Invested 5 hours trying today.... tomorrow is another day.
Going to try rigging a scissor jack with some type of heavy duty frame to press out the stud.
Might have to wait a few days... think I messed up my back.
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by gobium » Sun Jul 21, 2019 9:21 pm

You are fighting lot of sticky points.
Remove stand spring.
Sawzall the stud
Remove engine.
Cut release cut in middle of stud.
Basically reducing sticky points
Weld on bar at 90 degrees to stud, that is your anvil and turns lever.
Simple.
If you use a press you will snap the aluminum case ear mounts!

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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by jeffsaline » Sun Jul 21, 2019 10:48 pm

I've had good results using an air hammer to remove stuck axles. Maybe you could try that on the studs.

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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by Snakeoil » Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:35 am

Shock is your best friend. Slow pressure from a press is not going to break things free. To Van's point, it will damage other things like the aluminum lugs on the engine case. A good analogy is snatching the tablecloth out from beneath the dishes on the table. If you pull slow, all the dishes move with the tablecloth. But if you pull fast, they stay put and the tablecloth is free. The stud is the tablecloth here.

His suggestion to cut the stud in the middle after you get the engine out is a excellent one. As he said it will reduce the total area you are trying to break free. Better to be breaking free one lug at a time rather than two. Two have twice the grip on that stud.

Be careful with the torch. You can remove the temper from the aluminum and you CANNOT restore it like you could with steel. I would not take it over 250F.

I like the air hammer suggestion combined with Van's suggestion to weld a right angle bar to the stud. Just don't go crazy. Patience is key here.

And twisting the stud is not necessarily the best method. You could break it free in a twisting direction, but still have interlocking rings of corrosion that still have to be sheared before the stud will come out of the lugs. You could very well find that you can get the stud to turn at some point, but still not get it to slide out of the lug(s).

If all efforts to get the studs out of the engine lugs fail after you get the engine out by sawing the studs, I have a potential method that might do the trick.

Phosphoric acid will eat rust. I believe it will also eat aluminum oxide. How fast it will eat actual aluminum is an unknown to me. You might want to first test it on a piece of scrap aluminum. If you can leave a piece of aluminum in the acid overnight and only see the surface frosted, I'd proceed.

My thought is to put the engine on its side and pour small amounts of phos acid into the lug/stud area and let it eat. It may be what is needed to free up the studs by removing the rust and aluminum oxide.

Here is another thought that is a bit outside the box, but might help. Use a pressure washer with the lance nozzle (straight stream, most pressure) and blast the area between the stud and the lug. We found that some corrosives can be partially dissolved or freed up a bit with water when trying to remove buckets (blades) from gas turbine rotors. It sure can't hurt to try it.

Good luck.
Regards,
Rob
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by glacoste » Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:41 am

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Was able to remove engine by cutting the studs.
Still have the whole stud stuck in front and half in rear.
To be continued.....
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by S 854 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 10:00 am

Somewhere on SS is a thread regarding cleanliness on which I posted I rarely clean anything off my rig...

I recently pulled the engine/transmission to replace the 3-4 shift fork and collar... the oil, grease and grime buildup on my engine is truly impressive... but each engine mounting nut came off and both studs were removed with little effort...

Doesn’t do the OP much good but may give the OCD members something to consider... :lol:
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by glacoste » Wed Jul 24, 2019 2:42 pm

:D I sent the engine with the heads removed to Terry Crawford. There's plenty of pitting from the salt corrosion on the engine case. If he's unable to remove the seized studs were going to go with a used engine case. I am also having the crank shaft replaced.
I purchased the bike last January and it was a mess with most of the powder coating flaking off. Surface rust everywhere. I know it was rode all year round through the Vermont winters. Salt has done a number on it. I understand that some don't clean off there rigs and have no problems. But when you ride it on salted roads during the winter without rinsing it off your going to have problems.
I knew I would have to go through everything on this bike to make it road worthy again. Not knowing anything about a Ural I just started taking it all apart. What a good way to learn about the bike. Plus having the Soviet steeds group to help me out has been great. I lnow thw machine has its quirks, but thats the nature of having one I would guess.
Once I do get it back up and running I plan just taking it out on nice days and keeping it away from wet, salty roads.
I've got plenty of pics of what salt can do if anyone's interested.
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by Mr Wazzock » Wed Jul 24, 2019 2:57 pm

Doesn’t do the OP much good but may give the OCD members something to consider... :lol:
Something else to worry about! :o

I've started spraying mine now.
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by glacoste » Wed Jul 24, 2019 4:31 pm

Here's what salt can do.... ugg!
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thumbnail - 2019-05-09T080328.156.jpg
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thumbnail (89).jpg
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Re: Engine Mounting Studs

Post by glacoste » Wed Jul 24, 2019 4:33 pm

thumbnail - 2019-07-05T165545.865.jpg
after pic....
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