Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

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Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by Bigbikerrick » Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:00 pm

Hello folks, something I have noticed with my Gear Up, is when I take off from the house first thing in the morning, when, I guess the transmission lubricant is cold, the first few shifts are always buttery smooth, as things warm up , the shift quality seems to deteriorate some, where you have to rev match more, and just be more cognizant of your shifting technique, to pull off smooth gear changes,when cold, it just clicks ( or clunks) but very smoothly. It seems to make no difference what lubricant is in there, I have used redline SPH, regular super tech gear lube, and currently Amsoil, it seems to make no difference.
Has anyone else experienced something like this?
Thanks,
Rick D.
2012 Ural Gear Up / Forest Frog color. 2008 Goldwing Champion Trike, 73 Guzzi Eldorado, 17 Guzzi Griso

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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by Snakeoil » Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:10 pm

This is typical for pretty much any tranny. The lube viscosity puts more drag on the gears and they come to a complete stop sooner, making for zero grinding or maybe a nicer way to put it is "attempts to mesh".

There is a technique that has been shared here before by others that I find works well. First, I always recommend that you use your toe on the heel portion of the shifter for more positive shifts. But the technique is to load the shift pedal in the direction you want to shift. So that means you take any and all play out of the shifter with light pressure. You can do this before or after you pull in the clutch. On Beemers, you normally load it before you pull in the clutch. Anyway, you pull in the clutch and pause for just a second or two to let the revs come down and then press down sharply on the pedal and it should slip right into gear.

For my tranny, 1st to 2nd is the worst offender. 2nd to 3rd shifts like a modern Honda. 3rd to 4th can be either so requires the technique as well. I tend to do it for all gears just to make it a habit.
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Rob
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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by Bigbikerrick » Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:52 pm

Thanks Rob. Makes total sense to me. I had read about your recommended technique here previously, and do use it, and it works. Funny thing with these trannys is the downshifts are totally smooth, with no shifter "trickery" needed. Just push down on the lever and it clicks down into the lower gear, no "grunch" at all.
Not quite to "honda standards", but close!
Rick.
2012 Ural Gear Up / Forest Frog color. 2008 Goldwing Champion Trike, 73 Guzzi Eldorado, 17 Guzzi Griso

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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by Lokiboy » Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:04 pm

You’ll also notice when the temperatures get in the 50s and 40s in the winter how much smoother the engine seems to run
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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by cookiemech » Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:22 am

This subject is of particular interest to me after the gearbox failure on my 2020 GU at 11K miles viewtopic.php?f=23&t=59183. After rebuilding the box with a new 3-4 shifter fork and 3-4 slider, and adjusting the shifter limits according to Gobium's method, it shifts better than it ever did before.

However, I suspect that the ease and smoothness with which a Ural gearbox shifts is very much dependent on the individual box. I have been employing the method described above by Rob (Snakeoil); Billy G wrote about that method as well and I copied it so I'd remember. Nevertheless, I'm only getting smooth (non-grinding) shifts about three out of four times, up and down. My 3-4 shift is, and always has been, perfect. Click and that's it. The only way I ever get smooth downshifts is by rev matching, and I don't always hit it right. 1-2 and 2-3 upshifts go well by slightly preloading the heel part of the shifter, clutch in, letting the revs drop, then pressing down firmly.

I hadn't thought about why it shifts better when cold, but of course . . .
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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by VWK75S » Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:48 am

Interest thing on my GU is some days it shifts as smooth as glass :) and the next day clunky. :?
John
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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by jgaffphoto » Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:25 am

For me it is a personal thing, mental and physical. When I am up and concentrating and aware, shifts are some and the bike runs great all around. If I'm tired, depressed, not concentrating on riding but on work or home or whatever, then everything is off on the bike.

Pirsig says as much in ZMM -

What we call workability of the machine is just an objectification of this peace of mind. The ultimate test’s always your own serenity. If you don’t have this when you start and maintain it while you’re working you’re likely to build your personal problems right into the machine itself.”
________________________________

Gosling XII - 2021 Ural cT
Gosling XI - 2017 Kawasaki Versys X 300
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Gosling VIII - 2007 Genuine Stella (LML Star)
Gosling VII - 2001 Kawasaki Concours
Gosling VI - 1999 Ural Tourist
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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by Bigbikerrick » Fri Sep 17, 2021 4:23 pm

Regarding..."For me it is a personal thing, mental and physical. When I am up and concentrating and aware, shifts are some and the bike runs great all around. If I'm tired, depressed, not concentrating on riding but on work or home or whatever, then everything is off on the bike."
Thats a very interesting concept, and what I believe gives a bike "character".Thats why Its hard to "bond" with a bike that is like an appliance, no matter how great it works. ( for example,some hondas) Thats why I like quirky bikes like the Ural, and Guzzis.
Rick.
2012 Ural Gear Up / Forest Frog color. 2008 Goldwing Champion Trike, 73 Guzzi Eldorado, 17 Guzzi Griso

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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by jgaffphoto » Fri Sep 17, 2021 4:52 pm

Agreed. While you can 'bond' or build in or feel your own biases while riding any bike, the Urals weirdness certainly makes it easier, and much more interesting.

My prior bile was a Kawasaki Versys X 300. Great great bike. I highly recommend it if you want a small ADV bike. Highway full loaded for camping, single track, dirt, pavement, whatever. It did all of it well. Well made, required little maintenance - example, set valves every 12000 miles.

I sold it and got a Ural. One reason was it was boring to own. Valves on the Ural? I have 2600 miles on the rig I bought in May and I've checked or set the valves 3 or 4 times already. Why? Its easy and I like to work on the bike. Pirsig again -

The first tappet is right on, no adjustment required, so I move on to the next… I always feel like I’m in church when I do this…The gage is some kind of religious icon and I’m performing a holy rite with it.
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Gosling XII - 2021 Ural cT
Gosling XI - 2017 Kawasaki Versys X 300
Gosling X - 2010 Yamaha TW200
Gosling IX - 2007 Genuine Stella (LML Star), with Cosy sidecar
Gosling VIII - 2007 Genuine Stella (LML Star)
Gosling VII - 2001 Kawasaki Concours
Gosling VI - 1999 Ural Tourist
Gosling V - 197? Honda CB550
Gosling IV - 1975 BMW R60/6
Gosling III - 1976 Honda CB360
Gosling II - 19?? Yamaha U5E
Gosling I - Goose's Kawa in Mad Max

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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by Ragmanxx » Sat Sep 18, 2021 1:02 am

True Foil Head to the Core!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's a compliment, of course.

Ragman
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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by jgaffphoto » Sat Sep 18, 2021 1:37 pm

Ragmanxx wrote:
Sat Sep 18, 2021 1:02 am
True Foil Head to the Core!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's a compliment, of course.
:D And take as such! THX.
________________________________

Gosling XII - 2021 Ural cT
Gosling XI - 2017 Kawasaki Versys X 300
Gosling X - 2010 Yamaha TW200
Gosling IX - 2007 Genuine Stella (LML Star), with Cosy sidecar
Gosling VIII - 2007 Genuine Stella (LML Star)
Gosling VII - 2001 Kawasaki Concours
Gosling VI - 1999 Ural Tourist
Gosling V - 197? Honda CB550
Gosling IV - 1975 BMW R60/6
Gosling III - 1976 Honda CB360
Gosling II - 19?? Yamaha U5E
Gosling I - Goose's Kawa in Mad Max

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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by Bigbikerrick » Sat Sep 18, 2021 5:17 pm

Hahaha, that's re assuring! I thought I was the only weirdo that enjoys doing valve adjustments!
Of course, the simplicity helps... no Desmo, or DOHC with shims to deal with!
Rick
2012 Ural Gear Up / Forest Frog color. 2008 Goldwing Champion Trike, 73 Guzzi Eldorado, 17 Guzzi Griso

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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by sagerat » Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:41 am

“Zen” may be the most overrated book involving a motorcycle ever written. I forced myself to read and regret I’ll never get those lost hours of my life back.

On the bright side, my ‘04 Tourist had a tranny that shifted as well as the Hondas and Kawis I’ve owned and my ‘12 GU shifts pretty doggone well.
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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by windmill » Sun Sep 19, 2021 8:48 pm

Bigbikerrick wrote:
Sat Sep 18, 2021 5:17 pm
Hahaha, that's re assuring! I thought I was the only weirdo that enjoys doing valve adjustments!
Of course, the simplicity helps... no Desmo, or DOHC with shims to deal with!
Rick
Had a E900, took a full weekend and at least 1 trip to the dealer to do the valves. Never again. :-x
Barry

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Re: Shifting Gears...Much smoother when cold.

Post by windmill » Sun Sep 19, 2021 8:48 pm

sagerat wrote:
Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:41 am
“Zen” may be the most overrated book involving a motorcycle ever written. I forced myself to read and regret I’ll never get those lost hours of my life back.
I remember reading it many years ago........don't remember a thing about it.
Barry

"Take care, sir," cried Sancho. "Those over there are not giants but windmills".

2007 Patrol 100k km and counting,
2018/20 M70

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