Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Woe unto you that bought the first model year of a major remake, perhaps this section can help address any 2014 and later model Ural "imperfections". Here's a special section for folks with the latest rigs to discuss 2014 and later model-related topics such fuel injection, 3-wheel disc brakes, hydraulic steering dampers, spin-on oil filters and other anomalies that don't belong on true Russsian motorcycle ;-P We've gone from using big hammers and greasy wrenches to needing computers and Ouija boards in order to fix our rigs.
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Please keep this section specific to issues pertaining to 2014 and later models such as fuel injection, sidecar and rear disc brakes and so forth. Ask general or non-2014 and later specific questions in the main Hammerin' & Wrenchin' section.
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Trevorski
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Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by Trevorski » Fri Mar 27, 2015 12:00 am

While I've got my '14 'dug into' for the shifter project (covered in another thread) I am also, at some point before re-assembly, going to try one of the other ideas that I have had along the way: there are indicator devices that measure/ hold the maximum vacuum that occurs downstream of the air filter element but upstream of the throttles- on the principle that once that maximum vacuum reading climbs to a certain level, it indicates that your air filter is restricted and needs changing or cleaning. Once you clean or change the filter, you push a button that releases it to zero-out, and then it monitors your next filter cycle. These are most often found on industrial/ commercial/ military type applications, not all that often on passenger vehicles. A common brand/ trade name is 'Filter Minder" but they tend to be bulky; Donaldson makes some that are smaller.

Here's one of the smaller, but not smallest Donaldson, called 'the Informer"- if the picture displays properly, you can see how it is calibrated to show actual max vacuum that has occurred downstream of the filter; I am just holding it in relation to the airbox:
Donaldson Informer on Airbox.jpg
Here's the smallest Donaldson, called a ServiSignal. It does not show incremental readings, it just has a preset threshold at which the indicator window goes from clear to red. They come in different ratings; this one 'goes red' at 15" H20 of vacuum. That's a bit more sensitive than is often used on gasoline engines but since it was a choice between a 15 and a 20, and since it's a fixed go/no-go, I decided I'd rather have it be sensitive. This is just the piece by itself:
Donaldson ServiSignal.jpg
This is the ServiSignal on the airbox.
Donaldson ServiSignal on airbox.jpg
Both of these have a female 1/8 NPT thread in their base. Plan is to get a bulkhead fitting with 1/8 threads and install it into the airbox wall in the general location shown, and then be able to swap/ try each of these to see which I prefer; if I somehow end up wanting neither, I cap/plug the bulkhead fitting.

Got each of these on ebay pretty cheap just by keeping an eye out. I think it is going to be interesting to be able to look at the variable readings on the incremental one just to gain a sense of what the normal readings are with a clean filter, but I sort of think that for longterm use, I may likely want to use the smaller ServiSignal (because it's smaller) as long as the 15" H2O is not over-sensitive- in which case I can keep eyes open for a 20" ServiSignal
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PNW Engine Guard, Biltwell "Tracker" handlebars, Depner 2-lever gated quadrant shifter... more in progress....
1976 Kawasaki KE125
2009 Royal Enfield AVL Scrambler- someone else's uncompleted project that I'll someday finish...
1995 Ural Tourist = "The Red Menace" owned 2007-April 2014.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by GHGoodwin » Fri Mar 27, 2015 6:31 am

Not to go low tech but wouldn't a couple of ports and a manometer work just as well? Not on the fly obviously
Hal

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by VWK75S » Fri Mar 27, 2015 7:01 am

I wonder if you'll find it false tripping during intermittent high revs (off-road obstacles)
John
The Ural's made Maine a much bigger state.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by barnone » Fri Mar 27, 2015 7:47 am

Neat idea. My Kubota tractors have an air filter restriction indicator.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by Trevorski » Fri Mar 27, 2015 1:57 pm

GHGoodwin wrote:Not to go low tech but wouldn't a couple of ports and a manometer work just as well? Not on the fly obviously
The advantage of this is that it tracks and holds the highest vacuum post-filter encountered, under any/all operating conditions, at any time since the last reset. So if your filter has loaded up to the point that it is restrictive under your actual riding, it tells you that- not something you could get under a non-moving bike (you could rev an engine in neutral, but you wouldn't be under load).
2014 Asphalt Gray Gear Up: "Drastic Measures"
PNW Engine Guard, Biltwell "Tracker" handlebars, Depner 2-lever gated quadrant shifter... more in progress....
1976 Kawasaki KE125
2009 Royal Enfield AVL Scrambler- someone else's uncompleted project that I'll someday finish...
1995 Ural Tourist = "The Red Menace" owned 2007-April 2014.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by Trevorski » Fri Mar 27, 2015 2:05 pm

VWK75S wrote:I wonder if you'll find it false tripping during intermittent high revs (off-road obstacles)
John
Revs alone should not have an effect, it's only when the engine is trying to pull air hard and the filter is creating more restriction than it should. If it does that (excessive restriction) under any conditions where you want optimal performance, this device lets you know. If you encounter a reading during unusual operating conditions and you want to see if it was really just a result of those way-out-of normal operating conditions, push the reset button and see if it recurs under normal op. conditions.

I previously had one of these (not same make/model, but same function/operating principal) on the air filter assembly on a diesel truck and found it quite useful- you're never running a filter that's too dirty, and you're also never changing a filter that's still got useful life left. Since it's a little cramped to get the lid off the EFI Ural airbox, this will let you know what's going on inside without having to open it up... and this measures actual restriction, not just trying to make a best eyeballed guess from looking at a filter and trying to decide how dirty is too dirty....

I am also a gauge geek... I find it interesting to know what is going on...
2014 Asphalt Gray Gear Up: "Drastic Measures"
PNW Engine Guard, Biltwell "Tracker" handlebars, Depner 2-lever gated quadrant shifter... more in progress....
1976 Kawasaki KE125
2009 Royal Enfield AVL Scrambler- someone else's uncompleted project that I'll someday finish...
1995 Ural Tourist = "The Red Menace" owned 2007-April 2014.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by VWK75S » Fri Mar 27, 2015 6:04 pm

Wonder what the DP is across the filter under heavy load?
John
The Ural's made Maine a much bigger state.

2009 GearUp 155,000kms
2007 Retro 25,000kms
1991 VWK75S 110,000miles

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by Trevorski » Fri Mar 27, 2015 11:44 pm

VWK75S wrote:Wonder what the DP is across the filter under heavy load?
John
That'll be part of what will be interesting to find out with these devices, especially the one that has the calibrated read-out. 20" H2O pressure drop across a filter element seems to be a fairly widely accepted indication of what's too much, in terms of when to change air filters, on a normally aspirated gasoline engine. One thing to consider is that the filter element in the EFI Urals cross-references to (among many other things) some 1990s GM cars with engines in the mid-2-Liter range (including the Chevy Beretta which had at least pretensions of sportyness). If this size air filter element was sufficient for adequate performance and MPG for an engine of that displacement (3 or more times the displacement of a Ural) for a vehicle multiple times the weight of a Ural, I am hoping that we find that this size filter element flows pretty freely under any sane Ural operating conditions as long as it is not really crammed full of dirt.

Something else that will be interesting will be to compare pressure drops (in same operating conditions and locations) across the filter between the Ural OE paper element and the Donaldson/Amsoil nanofiber element that I picked up new old stock off of ebay (correct size for the Ural, unfortunately it has been discontinued). In the automotive application, it was considered good for 100,000 miles with periodic cleanings- and with lower CCs meaning lower net airflow per mile I am hoping it'll flow nice and freely for a long time in the Ural application.
2014 Asphalt Gray Gear Up: "Drastic Measures"
PNW Engine Guard, Biltwell "Tracker" handlebars, Depner 2-lever gated quadrant shifter... more in progress....
1976 Kawasaki KE125
2009 Royal Enfield AVL Scrambler- someone else's uncompleted project that I'll someday finish...
1995 Ural Tourist = "The Red Menace" owned 2007-April 2014.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by Trevorski » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:50 pm

Circling back to this- I installed the smaller & more sensitive Donaldson indicator- at the same time I installed the NOS/discontinued Amsoil/Donaldson EAA air filter element- and have since ridden 2000+ km under a wide range of operating conditions, and not had any false trigger on the indicator; at the same time, from having these same-technology (though larger size) indicators on medium duty trucks in the past, I'm confident that it _will_ display if the filter's restriction goes over the indicator's setpoint. For me, I like knowing that I don't need to fool with the filter if it's clean, and also not riding around obliviously if the filter starts becoming restricted...
2014 Asphalt Gray Gear Up: "Drastic Measures"
PNW Engine Guard, Biltwell "Tracker" handlebars, Depner 2-lever gated quadrant shifter... more in progress....
1976 Kawasaki KE125
2009 Royal Enfield AVL Scrambler- someone else's uncompleted project that I'll someday finish...
1995 Ural Tourist = "The Red Menace" owned 2007-April 2014.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by barnone » Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:57 pm

Thanks for the update. Please post again when you have more kms on your rig.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by Trevorski » Fri Nov 25, 2016 1:26 am

Approximately a year later and a bit under approximately another 3000km on the rig, the ServiSignal filter minder (I am using the one that 'trips' at 15" H20, a pretty sensitive (in terms of detecting filter restriction for a gasoline engine) setting) has never false-triggered under any set of RPM or load (and there have been a couple of rides where I was hammering up some very long very steep grades in as tall a gear as I could hold).

I have had the filter box apart for some other work (such as running the wiring for a Dobeck EFI tuner) and my filter
(the Amsoil:
http://www.sovietsteeds.com/forums/view ... 23&t=40674 )
is still clean, so I know that it's not an issue of the ServiSignal failing to trigger when a filter is restricted.

When I had the filter box out to run the wires for the Dobeck, I noticed that the stock filter box has a small capped hose barb at one of its lower corners; you could use that to run a hose to one of these filter minders and mount the filter minder on a bracket at a location of your choice.
2014 Asphalt Gray Gear Up: "Drastic Measures"
PNW Engine Guard, Biltwell "Tracker" handlebars, Depner 2-lever gated quadrant shifter... more in progress....
1976 Kawasaki KE125
2009 Royal Enfield AVL Scrambler- someone else's uncompleted project that I'll someday finish...
1995 Ural Tourist = "The Red Menace" owned 2007-April 2014.

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by GHGoodwin » Fri Nov 25, 2016 9:58 am

Capped hose barb is for service. I was told it was Ural's idea for a vacuum sensor port. GOK how you could effectively balance the system off one port.
Hal

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by Tomcatfixer » Sat Nov 26, 2016 10:18 am

How could you test the ServiSignal filter minder to ensure that it will trip when it should? Brake bleeder vacuum pump?
- Chad

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Current rides:
2015 Ural cT "Mobile Chernobyl", 2001 Ural Patrol "Little Red Bear", 1999 Ural Tourist "The RPOC", Mid-Nineties Ural Tourist "The Heap", 1994 Honda VFR750F

Previous rides:
2007 Honda VTR1000 FireStorm (Super Hawk in U.S.)
2001 Buell Blast! - - - - - - - 2005 Yamaha FJR1300
1993 Honda CBR600F2 - -1984 Yamaha FJ1100
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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by VWK75S » Sun Nov 27, 2016 7:36 am

Tomcatfixer wrote:How could you test the ServiSignal filter minder to ensure that it will trip when it should? Brake bleeder vacuum pump?
Or fill a tube with the correct amount of water?
John
The Ural's made Maine a much bigger state.

2009 GearUp 155,000kms
2007 Retro 25,000kms
1991 VWK75S 110,000miles

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Re: Filter Minder for EFI air filter

Post by Trevorski » Thu Dec 08, 2016 11:56 pm

VWK75S wrote:
Tomcatfixer wrote:How could you test the ServiSignal filter minder to ensure that it will trip when it should? Brake bleeder vacuum pump?
Or fill a tube with the correct amount of water?
John
I used the very uncalibrated method of inhaling... which trips the indicator... just to make sure it works (because I bought it new old stock on ebay). These things are designed for and utilized in industrial commercial and military applications, so they're not frail. The operating technology is pretty simple- spring, piston, indicator window, and a ratchet latch holding at peak reading until you press the reset- not a lot to go wrong...
2014 Asphalt Gray Gear Up: "Drastic Measures"
PNW Engine Guard, Biltwell "Tracker" handlebars, Depner 2-lever gated quadrant shifter... more in progress....
1976 Kawasaki KE125
2009 Royal Enfield AVL Scrambler- someone else's uncompleted project that I'll someday finish...
1995 Ural Tourist = "The Red Menace" owned 2007-April 2014.

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