Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

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BinDerSmokDat
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by BinDerSmokDat » Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:43 am

Not sure why everyone is surprised by the impact of the coronavirus on trade. The dependency on China has reared it's ugly head before this. From the impact of tariffs on US farmers and lobstermen, to the creeping price of Harbor Freight tools. HF has been edging prices higher, absorbing some of the additional cost by having "good, better, best" lines that providing more quality at a better margin.

And this is not a new phenomenon. We sought cheap goods from Japan after WWII, then as their standard of living rose and prices became less competitive we transitioned to Korea, then to Taiwan and finally China.

In fact one of the more reliable ways to gauge when some secondhand goods/collectibles are made is to look for the "Made in" marks on them. Japan 40's-50's, Korea 60's-70', Taiwan 70's-80's, China 80's until now.

China has a MUCH larger population, so it's taken longer for the labor costs to be prohibitive to manufacture there. But labor costs have risen in some regions where manufacturing is clustered, causing manufacturing within China to move to areas with a cheaper workforce.

Like we discussed in the "Best Ural Toolroll Ever?" thread...many of us don't want or can't afford a $140 tool roll but when the Chinese knockoff is $37 and is 90% as good, it becomes viable.
I buy what works for my budget. I'd love to buy American but the reality is, that isn't feasible. It isn't a death knell per se, but you can't put all your eggs in the basket of American Manufacturing and expect to make a living, let alone get wealthy.
Diversify not only your purchases, but your career choice and financial investments.

When I retire at 60-62 it will be in large part due to foreign market growth in my portfolio. I've held foreign funds for years. People laughed when I didn't throw it all at dot com booms.
"Global economy" isn't just a buzzword, it's fact. So prepare yourself for that reality. I don't bemoan the "good ol' days" and I will retire wealthier than my parents or grandparents generation who thought "work harder, you'll get ahead" and a good chunk of my generation who couldn't read the writing on the wall.

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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by Bullethead » Fri Feb 21, 2020 8:41 pm

Thanks for that video, Lofty. I had a copy that I used to show students, but lost it somewhere along the line. Glad to see it’s still out and about. Used it to demonstrate where all our manufacturing jobs have gone and, sadly, what U.S. competition might require. That said, I too well remember a supply Sgt who, forty years ago, warned, “Someday, we’ll be trying to invade China barefoot...their making all our f**king boots!”
Way Out Western NY
2018 Gear Up; The Black Pearl
1977 Yamaha XS650D
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Lofty
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by Lofty » Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:02 pm

Bullethead wrote:
Fri Feb 21, 2020 8:41 pm
I too well remember a supply Sgt who, forty years ago, warned, “Someday, we’ll be trying to invade China barefoot...their making all our f**king boots!”
I remember a comment made by our Drill Instructor during basic training. He was advising us to police a particular piece of our issue gear, due to its overseas provenance.

His commentary was...a roughly hewn truth.

What he said can't be reworded in a polite way, so I won't attempt to do so here. Its spirit was quite similar to what your supply sergeant said, to be sure. :wink:
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Ducati Pilot
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by Ducati Pilot » Fri Feb 21, 2020 10:06 pm

BinDerSmokDat wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:43 am
Not sure why everyone is surprised by the impact of the coronavirus on trade.
China has a MUCH larger population, so it's taken longer for the labor costs to be prohibitive to manufacture there. But labor costs have risen in some regions where manufacturing is clustered, causing manufacturing within China to move to areas with a cheaper workforce.
Like we discussed in the "Best Ural Toolroll Ever?" thread...many of us don't want or can't afford a $140 tool roll but when the Chinese knockoff is $37 and is 90% as good, it becomes viable.
I buy what works for my budget. I'd love to buy American but the reality is, that isn't feasible. It isn't a death knell per se, but you can't put all your eggs in the basket of American Manufacturing and expect to make a living, let alone get wealthy.
Diversify not only your purchases, but your career choice and financial investments.
When I retire at 60-62 it will be in large part due to foreign market growth in my portfolio. I've held foreign funds for years. People laughed when I didn't throw it all at dot com booms.
"Global economy" isn't just a buzzword, it's fact. So prepare yourself for that reality. I don't bemoan the "good ol' days" and I will retire wealthier than my parents or grandparents generation who thought "work harder, you'll get ahead" and a good chunk of my generation who couldn't read the writing on the wall.
Yes, you nailed it on every level. Most don’t want to hear it, or somehow poo-poo the reality of it, as if subscribing to facts and the reality of global economics is somehow un-American.
It’s a little ironic if you consider we’re speaking of this on a site that promotes nothing more than the love for a Soviet, then Russian machine called a Ural. Those folks know a little something about economic catastrophe.
I also have done very well with my investments offshore, percentage wise, but it certainly won’t carry me forever at my modest level of investment. One thing I have to question though is this: if one has been committed to a career that’s been cultivated for decades and have been rewarded for it (not getting rich, but doing ok) it might be a little difficult to diversify ones career. Especially at mid to later stages of life and considering entering the workforce from scratch, once again, without the benefit of time.
Like you, I’m also shocked that people are so surprised by the potential ramifications of China shutting down, even for a moment, and I’m really blown away when people suggest that we can make up for it all here in the USA. It’s just not going to happen, at least right now. It would take decades and many, many choices that we as a population in the U.S. are simply not willing to make.
And I want my Ural, dammit! (A 2019+ GU in OD or Slate Grey, please.) Yada, yada, yada.
Goodwill to the universe, death to the corona virus and other potential pandemics, and goodwill to all. We can still certainly say we’re lucky to be Americans.
Southern Vermont.
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2006 Ducati S2R1000 “hot rod” build
1980 Yamaha SR250 Scrambler build
1979 Kawasaki KZ750 B-Twin “War Pig”
I will own a Ural, hopefully sooner than later.
I’m loving this forum!

treeman1942
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by treeman1942 » Sat Mar 14, 2020 11:02 pm

I am an online stock trader, TDAmeritrade. If I had waited until now to purchase my Ural Gear-Up, the order would have been canceled. Luckily, I purchased my Gear Up in 2019 when the market was still soaring. I love the thing, almost 3400 trouble-free miles. Zero regrets!
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1977 BMW R100/7 (original owner)
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by atlasheating » Sun Mar 15, 2020 10:50 am

I install Furnaces and Air Conditioners. The Furnaces used to say "Made in America" now they say assembled in america.
We have a lesser Builder Model line. The Furnaces are the same without insulation or upgrades. The Air Conditioners and Heat Pumps are made in China. I installed a couple of these units and I am quite impressed with the workmanship and quality. The price is very good as well. I decided that my business is not to be installing cheaper made in China (even though the quality seems to be there) equipment.

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Rich Maund
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by Rich Maund » Sun Mar 15, 2020 1:42 pm

After many years of Chinese junk, I do see their quality inching (centimetering?) upwards to better levels. I drive a van made in Mexico that is a copy of an Italian van but with a way better reinforced floor and suspension run by a Japanese computer and a USA made motor all run by an Italian company. I really can't complain, its pretty good!
This is my step ladder. I never got to know my real ladder.

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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by RC20 » Sun Mar 15, 2020 2:44 pm

Hoping things get better there soon. Its a very sad situation. I did see a stat that 38,000 people die worldwide every month from the flu. I had no idea.
Yea verily on recovery.

The flu stats are a good marker for why we should pay attention.

Let me throw one out. 250,000 people die in the US each year to to hospital and medical personnel screw ups.

My brother was an example. He had a bizarre incident with an aorta De-laminating they now think was due to an auto accident (your organs can get stretched in weird ways and his was a quarter front crash not his doing). Its rare and he is one of the few that was not a smoker, diabetic or other ill health issue. He actual is a poster child for it as he is a clean case that they can reference to what the symptom and issues just for that are. Not that he would not have gladly given up the honor.

So, in he goes, give him an IV in Emergency, stable and up to heart care Well Emergency is a stand alone entity in hospital as surgury, kid launching etc.

Now we did not find this out until way too late, IV are two types. Short and long term. Short term is just that and fine as long as less than (24 hours I think) Long term IV you need to take major steps to ensure no staph follows the needled down (and they have a protocol that ensures that)

What does the heart group do? they keep on using the short term IV for 5 days . Yep, on top of an Aorta blow out he now has a raging staff infection.

Latter on in treatment post patching the aorta, they tried to do it again. That time he reamed them (I was there and ready to deal with them if he could not).

Not a mistake, a deliberate decision not to follow protocol that is standard beat into Nursing students for the last 50 years or more.

amazing.
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Honda 90
2 x CB750K (one a true Japan Model flown to Hawaii by a P3 Orion Sub Patrol Aircraft!)
1 x CB700 SC ala Shaft Drive Nighthawk S (RC20 is the actual in house production Model)
1 x R80GS (ok to start with, learned to love it for what it was)
1 x CB450K

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tx2sturgis
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by tx2sturgis » Sun Mar 15, 2020 5:10 pm

It's not just about the labor prices for manufacturing in Asian and third-world countries.

A huge problem is the amount of local environmental damage done to the country where the raw materials are harvested, mined, transported, refined, processed, manufactured, etc.

As Americans, we dont want, and apparently wont tolerate that kind of negative impact on our land, air, and water.

EPA regulations make it just about impossible to be able to manufacture complex technology products(from scratch) in this country. And most Americans would not be happy if their cities and counties were heavily polluted.

Yeah, we can 'assemble' things here, but strip mining vast stretches of the American countryside for the raw materials needed for manufacturing is a different matter.
Rural Ural in Tulia Texas!

Current Ural: 2013 Ural Solo sT

Previous Ural: 2013 Ural Patrol

RC20
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by RC20 » Sun Mar 15, 2020 5:54 pm

I have a different take. EPA makes sure no pollutant. Johnson Control was making batteries in the US at least until a few years back, not sure now. Ironically an issue blew up about women doing that work, turns out they need more protection than men so for them to do that work they had to make the whole system tighter. Kind of ?????

The problem is that while we regulate, others don't. There have been ideas to level that out but none ever been implemented.

So, the nasty stuff shifts to places where they have no protections. Pretty ironic.

A while back there were comments about shipping our garbage to China, my feeling was, isn't that where it fame from? Make it here then its our problem (I have been known to take a different view of things!)
Fear No Gravel
Formerly Owned: ( various rides on others)
Honda 90
2 x CB750K (one a true Japan Model flown to Hawaii by a P3 Orion Sub Patrol Aircraft!)
1 x CB700 SC ala Shaft Drive Nighthawk S (RC20 is the actual in house production Model)
1 x R80GS (ok to start with, learned to love it for what it was)
1 x CB450K

Current:
1 x 2019 cT Terracotta

What I Did (I quit June 2 , 2019)
Mechanic/Technician/Engineer: Electro Mechanical Systems

treeman1942
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Re: Ural purchase now on hold. Cause...

Post by treeman1942 » Mon Mar 16, 2020 12:20 pm

Other than motorcycles, my hobby is online stock trading via TDAmeritrade, soon to be Charles Schwab. I buy all of my toys, cars, motorcycles, lawnmowers, etc, with the profits made. My account is now down over 50% and still falling. Luckily, I bought my Ural a year ago, otherwise, the purchase would be delayed! To say the least, I feel the OP's pain!
2019 Ural Gear Up, OD Green
1977 BMW R100/7 (original owner)
2014 Burgman 400/A
2008 Piaggio MP3250
Whizzer Motorbike

If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went.
Will Rogers

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