Bent crank?

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Mr Wazzock
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by Mr Wazzock » Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:53 pm

This is indeed excellent. :boogie:

Would love to know how the hell they broke the frame tho.
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jeffsaline
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by jeffsaline » Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:58 pm

As a guy that has done some welding on motorcycle frames may I suggest you remove the engine and do the repair well and correctly the first time. It doesn't take very long to remove an engine and will make it much easier for the welder and probably result in excellent results. Additionally it will make it much easier to inspect the rest of the frame for cracks. Start by looking for cracked paint and rust residue.

Best,

Jeff
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by Snakeoil » Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:45 pm

A loose engine mount is a common cause for bike vibes (not engine vibes). I suspect that the prank and the vibes are just a coincidence. My guess is you had a growing crack that finally let go. But, abuse by delinquents may have been enough to finish it off. Jumping up and down on the pegs could have been the last straw. But they were not the root cause.

Glad you found it and a relatively easy repair.
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by rougaroo » Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:50 pm

Check out the video on removing the engine and just pull the engine and gearbox out. I used to do all sorts of gyrations trying to do things just to avoid taking the engine out, but once you do it you realize is is waaay easier to do lots of things (read clutch job, etc) with the engine out.

With the engine out your guy can get at the frame from all sides comfortably and leave you without that nagging doubt in your mind as you're riding somewhere down the road.

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scottmastrocinque
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by scottmastrocinque » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:37 pm

sixbennetts wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 4:55 pm
scottmastrocinque wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:31 am
First off, I'm very sorry that criminals did this to you. It is underserved and uncalled for. I despise thieves.

More than likely, they broke lose something along the drive line, more than likely at the clutch/flywheel. The drive line is designed to apply force in one direction, from the engine to the drive shaft to the wheel. Trying to bump start the bike, especially down a hill at speed and with the skid mark you describe, the forces would have been applied the opposite direction, from the wheel to the driveshaft to the clutch plates and flywheel. I have seen a few BMW flat twins damaged from hard bump starting.

There is no way that I could think of to have bent a crankshaft from bump starting. Bent cranks come from hydro locking or physical obstruction.

Another item to look at is the engine mount bolts and flanges. Are any of them broken? Given that the engine starts and runs but gets worse as you increase the rpm's, something has been loosened in the engine or it's mounts which becomes more noticeable at speed. Your gearbox and the rest of the bike are fine, because they would not cause the issue you are describing because they are not in motion.

Worth looking into more closely. Especially given that the engine runs.
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SCOTTMASTROCINQUE nailed it! Broken front motor mount! Cracked right along the frame. Rear engine mount cross-bolt was also loose. We lashed the engine down to the frame very carefully and creatively with 3 tie-down straps and cinched them up tight. Started it up, revved it up, and vibration is almost gone!! Took the straps back off quick so they wouldn't melt.

THIS IS GREAT NEWS!! THE ENGINE INTERNALS ARE *PROBABLY FINE!!

Bad news of course is that we don't think it can be welded without taking the engine out. My buddy *wants to try it, but he can't guarantee not involving the engine case itself in the arc because it's just too tight in there. Plus, there's a lot of road grime in between the mount and block that really needs to be cleaned out for a good weld to happen. He also thought of grinding from the outside in, then welding his way back out, but said that's only if we don't take the engine out.

Wonder if the engine can be disconnected and jacked up in the frame. Looks like there's enough room above it for a little clearence.

Anyways, I don't have a welder, so I'll have to AAA the bike to his garage, have him remove/lift the engine, clean it, grind it, weld it, and squirt some paint on it. Given the fact that the next 10 days are in the 30's here, and I ain't getting any older, we've decided to spray the area well with WD40 and park it for the winter to be tackled in the spring. Yes, I'm a weak little nancy-boy for not riding much in the winter!

I am relieved beyond words that we didn't have to crack the case, (provided the broken mount was the only thing wrong).

Thanks everyone for the suggestions, though. They're greatly appreciated, and scottmastrocinque, what kind of beer do you want!? :cheers:
Thank you for the kind words. I'm delighted that I found the cause of your problem.

I do appreciate your beer offer, but your happiness at finding the problem is more than enough for me.

Best wishes on repairing and returning your motorcycle to service!

Warmest regards,

Scott
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Mr Wazzock
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by Mr Wazzock » Mon Nov 11, 2019 2:57 pm

:D
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sagerat
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by sagerat » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:57 pm

Great news!
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Desantnik-VDV
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by Desantnik-VDV » Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:28 am

Better news for all of us. :)
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by Albuquralque » Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:09 am

I would like to make one observation and one suggestion.

Not sure what they could've done to crack the frame in that location. What ever they did must have taken a lot of force.

In my opinion, it would be best to remove the engine and thoroughly inspect the frame.......not only in that location but also move rearwards and look closely at where the rear engine mount stud is.....both sides of frame.

I would also get the engine up on a bench and thoroughly inspect the front and rear mounting through holes in the engine block. The frame is steel......engine block aluminum.

Take your time and do it right the first time.......OMG....I am turning into my father!!!!
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Claus
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by Claus » Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:55 am

Albuquralque wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:09 am
n my opinion, it would be best to remove the engine and thoroughly inspect the frame.......not only in that location but also move rearwards and look closely at where the rear engine mount stud is.....both sides of frame.

I would also get the engine up on a bench and thoroughly inspect the front and rear mounting through holes in the engine block. The frame is steel......engine block aluminum.
+1
Albuquralque wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:09 am
Take your time and do it right the first time.......OMG....I am turning into my father!!!!
This seems to be international! :lol:
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by sixbennetts » Tue Nov 12, 2019 3:13 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol:

You guys are too much! You really don't realize the value of a group of enthusiast who know their machines intimately until you break something and ask for help or opinions. Please, don't go changin'!

Yes, we WILL be pulling the engine & crunchbox in the spring. We'll also be drawing the oil, removing the oil pan, and inspecting the INSIDE of the case around the front mounts, (as per Van's advice on Messenger), as well as all mounting points on the frame.

The route that the, 'colorful young men', pushed it had recent scuff marks on the concrete curbs, and the hill they went down also had tracks in the grass showing they had been zig-zagging down the hill, probably just enjoying the ride.

This lead me to look under the outfit, and there I found a couple spots on the frame of bright metal from hitting the curb. I also found slightly flattened exhaust headers on the bottom. And a good scratch on the oil pan. There's also a decent scratch under the front right sidecar nose.

I cringe at the idea of a dogpile of these assholes pushing it fast enough to jump curbs with it, piling onto it, and flying down the hill with it.

I want heads on spikes. :cry: :evil:
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Mr Wazzock
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Re: Bent crank?

Post by Mr Wazzock » Tue Nov 12, 2019 5:32 pm

sixbennetts wrote:
Tue Nov 12, 2019 3:13 pm
The route that the, 'colorful young men', pushed it had recent scuff marks on the concrete curbs, and the hill they went down also had tracks in the grass showing they had been zig-zagging down the hill, probably just enjoying the ride.
More likely don't know how to drive an outfit. Narrowly avoided an all out crash by the sounds of it. :o

I have told the story my dealer told me haven't I? Years ago he had a rig stolen in the night. Next morning he found it a mile or so down the road in the middle of a traffic island (roundabout). The thief didn't know how to steer it so couldn't get it around the island.

Anyway that would explain your cracked frame sure enough.
Mike H
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(aka Oranzhevaya Opasnost, "The Orange Peril")

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Re: Bent crank?

Post by Geno89074 » Tue Nov 12, 2019 7:19 pm

Best of Luck with your repairs!!
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