re power a ural?

The "Pimp my Ride" section for Soviet bloc bikes. Everybody seems to have their own custom add-ons, modifications & accessories. Share your tips and post pictures of them here.
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Darman
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Re: re power a ural?

Postby Darman » Sun Jan 07, 2018 4:53 pm

rivers wrote:
Lmo wrote:
Sorry, I can't imagine any option that won't be more expensive, difficult, and time consuming in the long run than simply fixing it.


I second the sentiment.

I'll 3rd that. Rebuild the bottom end on an airhead BMW and then tell me how expensive Ural parts are. :o
Sounds like you're fed up with the entire Ural experience and don't want to even look at it any more. Not a neg comment on your feelings, cause I can see it happening to folks. The older I get, the less I enjoy or can afford to work on all vehicles so I get you wanting to punt. :( You say currently you lost a wrist pin keeper? Hows the compression on the other jug? How many kms total on the motor. If the good jug is within reason, just replace the bad jug and piston and freshen up the good side so both sides are near the same condition/comp. Forget about what money you've already put in to it. That's the past and that money is already spent, long gone, history and never to be seen again so it's not in play any more. It's cheaper to fix what you "need" to fix w/o fixing what you suspect you may need to fix someday. Before you punt diagnose what you actually need then talk with Crawfords, Holopaws, Heindls, Skis etc and see what they have avail used or new. If you're considering parting it out, sell the entire bike in one shot at an attractive dirt cheap price for a non-runner and just be done with it. Parting out a bike that there isn't much market for is going to be a long PITA process. Sure you'll get a few bucks dribbling in occasionally but you'll be dealing with disassembling, cleaning, advertising, getting shipping quotes etc for a long time and still end up stuck with most of it. Sorry for your situation but the cheapest route is fix what you got or if you decide to bail out, sell the entire lump in a one shot deal and be done with it forever.
Just one man's opinion.
Good luck.


I cant say I dont miss my rig, I LOVED it, I think it was having it a little damaged in a fire, then spending a pile of money to make the clutch work again, then getting injured in an accident and waiting a few more years, then making it run and riding it round the yard, reliving what it was to pilot the thing ( Thanks to MANY here that helped make that happen, Tinman, Van, Gene from Holapaws ) only to pull it in the shop to install the last bits, ammo box, hack nose luggage rack, bumper, getting all that done and hitting the starter button as I had for hundreds of times only to find out that created another HUGE breakdown.
After all the long wait then making it run again, only to have the wind taken out of my sails because a carb that was redone leaked some gas into the jug... We are faced with many issues with these rigs, we all know they are not the best n brightest. Years of advancements in metallurgy, wheels,(round ones! great idea!! ) bearings, gears, they still make them better, but now they are so expensive for new models they have priced themselves out of my league. But they are something we just cant get any other place. I remember seeing the first mention of them, way back when. I remember seeing the first one in person, a red 650 version. I never gave up on the desire to own one. I was the King of the world when I found this rig and Andy made me a good deal on it. ( and I had a pile of money that was not a normal occurance in my life...) I justified the usage of it. and I did use it. I believe in enjoying life, not just existing, the Ural added something I used to call "the glee factor". If you can do what you have to do in your life but do it in a way that also brings you joy then that's the glee factor. The ural made a simple trip to town for groceries an adventure. People stop n stare when the wife and I pushed a full shopping cart up to the rig and wondered.."how they gonna get all that home??? O.O" The real fun was spending a day when we didn't have to work just puttering down an old dirt road in the Ozarks. Owning and driving a Ural sidecar rig is something I do not have to explain to those of you that have them. Having that taken away from me more than once and working hard to get it back and not one but a few times leave a loss in what we kinda took for granted when all we had to do was walk out turn on the gass and hit the starter button and away we went on the next joyride.


I own whats left of this 09, and if I can make it go with something I have then I stand in the wind and say hey I am not beaten. If you dont understand what that means then maybe you have never lived in your car, or struggled to live when you could no longer pay the light bill. I have been at the bottom, to own my gearup was something I waited decades to achieve. Lightning almost burning my barn down and getting my arm crushed set me back but I am not beaten. So, fed up with the whole Ural experience? Not by a long shot. Discouraged by prices that seem to be crazy high? Well blame that on riding Harleys for years, pistons, jugs, new crank, all can be had for the price of just one new crank for the Ural. and not one that will be ruined by a little gas in the cylinder either. Knowing what I know now, if I ever get the thing running of course I will turn it over with the kicker before ever trusting to touch the starter button. But I had never ever heard of this problem or about 3 piece $500 cranks pressed together that a little starter could render into light weight boat anchors with one push of a button. That still seems surreal to me...
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"better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it", Capt. Woodrow Call

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby VWK75S » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:42 am

Darman wrote: But I had never ever heard of this problem or about 3 piece $500 cranks pressed together that a little starter could render into light weight boat anchors with one push of a button. That still seems surreal to me...

:deadhorse: Just fix the thing and go for a :moto:
2009 is the best year I've put over 130,000km on my GU. If I were closer I'd give you a hand.
:cheers: John
The Ural's made Maine a much bigger state.

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby Mr Wazzock » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:21 am

rivers wrote:
Lmo wrote:
Sorry, I can't imagine any option that won't be more expensive, difficult, and time consuming in the long run than simply fixing it.


I second the sentiment.

I'll 3rd that.

Fourthed.

VWK75S wrote: :deadhorse: Just fix the thing and go for a :moto:

Yep and newer parts should be better, so can get a D10 crank for it now. Or I believe so (please advise if I'm wrong)

Rebuild the bottom end on an airhead BMW and then tell me how expensive Ural parts are. :o

+1. Any parts for a Bee-Em (especially from a dealer - or a Honda, for that matter) make Ural parts prices suddenly look quite reasonable.


HTH
Mike H
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Re: re power a ural?

Postby gobium » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:32 am

D10 is not bullet proof if you dont kick first before using e starter
Hydro lock will tweet the crankshaft.

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby Mr Wazzock » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:38 am

OK, but looking on the bright side, a chance to upgrade?
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Re: re power a ural?

Postby stagewex » Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:13 am

Personally I'd just get a good used pre-2014 from one of the better known vendors (or maybe COPART) and bolt it in.

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=46171
EFI but can apparently convert back to carbie.
"New Style crankshaft". I guess that is good?

You have to love these things. If you don't love them anymore then it's just time to move on.
Advice from a mechanic who resolved a (simple but) frustrating issue on my BMW /2. That advice came with quite a bit of expense as well.
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2007 Ural Patrol, 2006 Yamaha TW200, 1995 BMW K75, 1969 BMW r60/2US

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby Michal » Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:25 pm

gobium wrote:D10 is not bullet proof if you dont kick first before using e starter
Hydro lock will tweet the crankshaft.


Not necessary.
I've just drilled center of carburetor bowls and pressed in piece of 3mm brass tube so any excessive gas just overflows down the floor instead of inside the cylinder.
The bowl design is ready for that tube because all other Keihin carbs I've seen have this tube installed at factory.

Also a good vacuum operated petcock should prevent major flooding, unlike a manual swap.
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Re: re power a ural?

Postby gobium » Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:54 pm

Michal wrote:
gobium wrote:D10 is not bullet proof if you dont kick first before using e starter
Hydro lock will tweet the crankshaft.


Not necessary.
I've just drilled center of carburetor bowls and pressed in piece of 3mm brass tube so any excessive gas just overflows down the floor instead of inside the cylinder.
The bowl design is ready for that tube because all other Keihin carbs I've seen have this tube installed at factory.

Also a good vacuum operated petcock should prevent major flooding, unlike a manual swap.

Good idea

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby VWK75S » Tue Jan 09, 2018 6:11 am

Michal wrote:I've just drilled center of carburetor bowls and pressed in piece of 3mm brass tube

Picture?
John
The Ural's made Maine a much bigger state.

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby dneprlover » Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:13 am

Michal wrote:
gobium wrote:D10 is not bullet proof if you dont kick first before using e starter
Hydro lock will tweet the crankshaft.


Not necessary.
I've just drilled center of carburetor bowls and pressed in piece of 3mm brass tube so any excessive gas just overflows down the floor instead of inside the cylinder.
The bowl design is ready for that tube because all other Keihin carbs I've seen have this tube installed at factory.

Also a good vacuum operated petcock should prevent major flooding, unlike a manual swap.


Russian Pekar and German Bing carbs have an overflow relief tube or port built in to the float bowls, as do many other makes of carbs. Gives a warning that fuel is passing when it shouldn't be, without risking flooding the crank cases.

Good modification Michal!
Neval BMW/MT11 800cc hybrid, Neval 2wd MT10-36, Neval standard MT10-36, Neval MT16, another MT11, BMW/MB650 hybrid , K750m and an MB750 with locking diff.

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby INSUBORDINATOR » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Try to purchase a totaled rig that ran until crashed - that has no engine damage.
Current Motorcycles: 02 Ural Tourist, 2010 modified Royal Enfield G5 Deluxe.

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby gobium » Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:17 pm

Resized_20180109_111231.jpeg
Mikuni on my Dnepr
Notice the bowl over flow

Cvk 32 doesnot have over flow only bowl vent
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Re: re power a ural?

Postby Lmo » Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:30 pm

Posted as reference only. Proceed at own risk.

Source: http://web.ncf.ca/ag136/floatDrainTubes.htm

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Text of article

Carburetors used to have overflow tubes so that if the float valve stuck open, excess gas would run out on the engine, then onto your boots, then onto the ground. You would be warned and fix the float valve or the petcock or whatever.

Probably for EPA reasons, Kawasaki and Keihin conspired to produce and deliver Concours carbs sans overflow tubes. What this means is, if the float valve sticks open, instead of leaking gas all over the ground, gas trickles into the cylinder. Then when you try to start the bike, it comes to a sudden stop. If you're lucky, you just pull the spark plug and trickle the same gas onto the same ground. If you're not so lucky, it bends the connecting rod, and you take the engine apart and trickle the same damn gas on the same damn ground.

So first I grabbed a RHS float bowl, $5.00 US NOS from eBay (Sept. '06), so I could have a good look without taking the bike out of service. The Keihin CVK 32 carb float bowls have what looks like an unused boss exactly where a overflow tube is just begging to go. Moreover, if drilled through into the drain screw passage, this overflow runs out the existing bottom nipple regardless of whether the drain screw is closed.

There was a discussion on the COG Forum called 'Absolute hydrolock protection' in October '06, which I saved in text format.

Then (Nov. '07, some projects require extended analysis) bought one foot of 1/8" O.D. copper tube, $1.53 CDN all up, at a local hobby shop, it's used to make slot cars or RC helicopter frames or something. Brass, aluminum, steel, stainless tubing would probably be just as good. I.D. is approximately 3/32".

From the top using a drill press (no less), first drilled a 3/32" through hole to meet up with the drain. Then proceeded with a 1/8" drill to give a gentle sliding/press fit for the tube - stopped the drilling just before it went clear through, yielded a bottom-shouldered hole, the tubing just goes in and stops. Cut the tube at 4 mm above top of float bowl rim, it's approximately 36 mm total length.

The first attempt at sealing the tube in the hole used Permatex #1 gasket sealant. According to the package, it was supposed to cure hard and be gasoline resistant. Didn't work very well and one of the bowls started leaking. So now (May '08) I'm using epoxy, so far so good. Cleared out excess glue with a 3/32" drill.

Reassembled the RHS float bowl to the carb body carefully, the tube didn't seem to bind on anything.

April '08, took a test ride with the one modified float bowl, no leaking, seems to work.

Removed the other three float bowls to complete the modifications. If you're patient, it's possible to remove the float bowls with the carbs on the bike. While in there, I changed the main jets from 125 to 120 and replaced the bowl screws with stainless button-head allen bolts.


note: author used copper tube, brass tube (also available at hobby shops) would be marginally stronger.
Lew

EDIT - Just as a reference, BMW Bing overflow tubes are smaller than 1/8" ID.
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Re: re power a ural?

Postby Peter Pan » Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:56 pm

or siting an incomplete rig obstructing the shop space....
Have a Jawa rig with Husquarna engine doing right that....
as longer it sits there as less fun it becomes to screw on it. I got fed up when the air filter box became nasty and noticed finally that engine numbers got screwed up in the shop that did the engine rebuild. Expensive boat anchour.
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With a DIY foam air filter the rig runs well even in tropical rain. The air box looks then like an aquarium. :moto:
Final drives: 1. at 5000km, 2. at 34.000km(+friction plates)
transmission: 1. 39.000km. 2. on its way.

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Re: re power a ural?

Postby Mr Wazzock » Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:22 pm

Michal wrote:Also a good vacuum operated petcock should prevent major flooding, unlike a manual swap.


Stories I've heard of is where the vacuum tap gubbins perishes, then gas leaks direct from there down the vacuum tube to inlet manifold, and that's how it gets into cylinder. The carb is bypassed so is not the culprit.

One story was of a Yamaha that had been standing a while, won't start, totally locked solid, but reeks of gas; bloke takes it to his mate (who know better) who discovers sump is brim full of a mixture of oil and gas.
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